Woodford Patient Capital Trust – what you need to know


The offer period of Neil Woodford’s widely anticipated Investment Trust – Woodford Patient Capital Trust plc - is now open, Tom Stevenson, gives his a
[See the full post at: Woodford Patient Capital Trust – what you need to know]


Considering the amount of money he manages I expect this to be heavily over subscribed as he’s seeking such a small amount.

I’m minded to subscribe but if it is over subscribed I would be annoyed of I only got something like £400 or £500 worth. I’d rather get nothing than a paltry amount.

This would be my first investment trust if I get it.


Amazed to see Fidelity Funds Network promoting an investment trust. Usually you can only get Fidelity trusts on their platform which is why I transferred my money away.

This looks like a fantastic launch. I usually don’t like performance fees but who can quibble with this when they are taking no management fee.

I hope this is copied by other investment trusts that insist on charging a management fee AND a performance fee.


I overheard people in the lift in the office building I work from talking about this this morning which I took as an indication this will be hot.

If there is a crazy amount of demand it will go to a premium and be there for some time whilst demand s met.

One thing to consider though is this will take a long time to properly perform, and it probably won’t deliver great results before the next downturn, and stock market being stock markets, poor and average performers wont do well so I do see opportunity for buying at a good price in future.


I wouldn’t be too bothered trying bet on the price/discount if that’s what you’re suggesting @andre. An investment like this should be bought and then forgotten about for 5-10 years. It’s perfect for a Sipp pension, a bit like private equity investment trusts.

I agree with @eurofile about the extent of scaling back, we don’t want a lastminute.com jobbie where we were scaled back to £110 or something ridiculous like that. £1000 should be the minimum allocation.


Well the great Neil Woodford answering our questions, he is keen to get this away, as he should be.

Perhaps I should get my thinking cap on and come up with a meaty question for him to ponder :-0


Here is the question I put:

How long do you expect it to take for the trust to be fully invested and with this in mind how long of an investment horizon do you believe potential investors should take?

I asked this because my investment are divided in to short term and longer term and I suspect this to be a longer term investment of say 5-7 years minimum but I want this confirmed.


Here is my effort…

This trust looks to me to be more like a private equity fund or maybe a VCT.

My question is what level of experience do you have investing in these types of companies and do you have the resources to properly evaluate them and track them?

I am curious because it seems to me that your experience as far as I’m aware is with income investing in super large companies and this trust will require different skills surely.


I asked this -

My question is will Neil Woodford and his management team be investing their own money into this trust too. And by own money I don’t mean share options, I mean putting their hands in their pockets.

My reason for asking this is it’s hard to really evaluate this new trust because many of the companies its intending to invest in are not listed, or are tiddlers or difficult to understand in the case of biotech so it’s comforting to see the management investing alongside us punters.


Hargreaves are waving commission fees for anyone buying this I wonder if other brokers will do the same to win business.

I use ATS, no sign of them waving their fees.


Charles Stanley Direct aren’t discounting fees and I haven’t read of anyone else doing it. Might just be Hargreaves.



I asked if the trust will take controlling stakes in companies or very large minority holdings of say 20/30 or more per cent.

And will they be acting almost like another director to the companies they’re investing in much like Private Equity does, and get involved in issues such as strategy, management personnel etc.


The prospectus states that, once fully invested, the number of holdings is likely to be between fifty and one hundred. The prospectus also tells us that the Portfolio Manager and its employees can co-invest alongside WPCT. Presumably, these parties will not invest in every Early Stage/Growth company. So, persumably, they will be quite selective about the companies in which they choose to invest.

Two question. What might WPCT’s shareholders infer about the unquoted holdings that do not attract co-investment? And how will selective co-investment align the Portfolio Manager’s interests with those of WPCT’s shareholders more successfully than if the Portfolio Manager was, instead, just to buy ordinary shares in WPCT at the IPO and thereafter? Performance fee notwithstanding.


To repeat what I wrote in the box thing above…

Over say a 10 year period when averaged out what sort of return do you expect to make or hope to make?


I hope Mr Woodford and co give these questions due consideration because I certainly think they are more challenging than they have likely encountered elsewhere.

Well done to Mr @arkwelder for going through the prospectus so thoroughly. Allowing employees of Woodford to co-invest isn’t necessarily something I would be against, it depends on how it’s set up, how open it is and the reasons behind it but I would like to see their response to it.

I am like many here considering investing and I look forward to Woodford’s response to several of the points raised here.


I joined yesterday and this is my first post – a question for Neil Woodford’s team. I suspect some of you might find yourselves in a similar position. Here goes…………Are X-O (Jarvis) and Halifax (ShareDealing) taking part in the IPO? My family & I use them for our ISAs, SIPPs and Share Dealing Plans and we all want to buy shares. If they’re not, it would be very messy having to use application forms and then have to sell/buy back/transfer shares; so we may decide not to bother. What are our options if they’re not taking part?.. I phoned Jarvis & Halifax and the advisors said they were almost certain that they were not taking part, which really surprised me because they seem to have taken part in almost every other IPO in the last year.


Halifax are taking part in the IPO @djauk6 I had an email from them inviting me to apply. I’ve never heard of X-O Jarvis.



Halifax are taking part @djauk6 and I’d b surprised if X-O weren’t. Every broker seems to be involved.

On another point, congrats on your first post. It works a little bit like Twitter in the forums in that you use the @ symbol in front of names. If you want your name to be @DavidS instead of @djauk6 contact the moderators. They said in the newsletter they can change usernames. :slight_smile:



@arkwelder I haven’t spotted anyone else talking about this. Maybe you’re the only one to have read the prospectus in full.

I wonder if they are structuring their analysts to specialise in different areas and that’s why they’re inviting them to invest direct in deals of their choosing. #WellSpotted


Thanks for the helpful comments. I’ve never used Twitter, CityGirl. I hope this reply goes to the right place and is in the correct format. @wickedinvestor I’ve been with X-O for about 6 years now. Very good customer service and their charging structure for ISAs, SIPPs and Share Dealing Plans is also very good. Previously I had most of my investments with Alliance Trust but moved everything to X-O and Halifax when Alliance Trust increased their charges quite dramatically a year or two ago. You’ll find X-O at www.x-o.co.uk. It’s is run by Jarvis Investment Management and is an execution only service. The company is Jarvis Securities plc (JIM).